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13 To 1 Compression What Octane

Best to experiment. the down side is you need to always use freshand good quality pump fuel. As a general rule though, you can run another point of compression with aluminum heads over cast heads. When 1 crappy tank of gas is all you need to ruin a 5k plus engine. 5:1 static compression and Dart aluminum heads. the cam timing will have to be matched to the compression selected because it allows some bleed down. 80's at around 115 mph. 5:1 compression ratio would run the risk of auto-ignition, and it could shoot out a rod or spin a bearing. Engine building book I have says 5 point of octane per each point of compression increase. Compression #1 130psi #2 132psi clean carbs ,twice and jets. Power is determined by a number of factors and the compression ratio is one of the prime factors. Because higher octane gas burns slower, it is more resistant to knock when subjected to higher RPM and cylinder pressures. I am going to go look at a built up yfz and it has a CP 13. 5:1 compression!! The guy I bought it from recommended I use 25% Race Fuel, the rest 91octane. 4) The type & octane of fuel you use is a main contributor to what compression to use, so the higher the octane the higher the compression you can use safely but it's still beneficial to run a lower rather than higher compression ratio. The CR on a engine can be 10-1 on one and run 87 octane just fine but that don't mean that all with 10-1 CR can because the camshaft determines the DCR. generally, what octane does a 13-13. If you use an MSD box and want to cruise around with 87, just pull some timing. Hello All, A question about Octane vs Compression ratio: With the prices of gasoline going sky-high, and the possibility of running lower-octane, what is the relationship between the two? If you are going to rebuild an engine, should the compression ratio be high or low if you run 89 octane? Steve [This message has been edited by SteveFlier (edited 05-09-2001). You fill the ASTM-CFR full of your mystery fuel and, for automotive fuels, you run two test protocols using the ASTM. I run 91 octane fuel and have 10. Effective stroke is 3. I set my new motor up for E85 and makes more power and torque yet runs cooler. Most engines will lose ET & MPH if you run too much octane, at least all of mine & friends I've helped out did. It's not too far from my work and not far from the SIR drag track out here. Higher octane does not mean more power except in some very specific conditions, such as computer controlled ignition advance with a knock sensor. Seriously considering getting a KLE500 just for this trip. I can tell you for sure that is not the case. 5:1, so clearly, it needs a higher Octane Fuel. generally, what octane does a 13-13. Im posting this question for a friend. 70 gears so RPM should be about 2800-3000 on the highway. Compression #1 130psi #2 132psi clean carbs ,twice and jets. 1970 Fastback (to be finished outside as a Boss 302 clone) 393 Windsor AFR 205 heads with 11. Which octane you need is mostly a function of compression and ignition timing. Everything else was the same. 5:1 compression will usually require 93 octane. Low octane gas still hates it. To the contrary, high octane fuel has a more controlled combustion than low octane. Any advice on the subject? My goal is to make a street legal race car with 500+hp. How much compression would this be and what is the lowest octane to use without having problems?. (This is known as engine knock and can be. stroked, forged, balanced, butterflied flat tops, stage 3 cams, 38cc TFS heads. It runs fine on 100 octane LL Av gas or race gas, but I did try some 94 octane once to see if I could get away with it. My dad had a bay boat a few years ago and it would top out 500 RPM better with 93 vs 87 octane. 4:1 are not recommended for use with "92 octane pump gas". RON is determined by running the fuel in a test engine with a variable compression ratio under controlled conditions, and comparing the results with those for mixtures of iso-octane and n-heptane. I have built a few 13. + By advancing the valve timing allows some blow back into the intake manifold that reduces some compression. (RON+MON) method = 87 octane most common form of rating in the west. But the pre-ignition is a serious issue and is worse in high compression engines such as most modern day vehicles. There’s a highly-sensitive and accurate knock-sensor and computer hooked up to this engine that gives a readout of knock. I would go through 2-3 tanks of fuel to get a good average. Typical commercial fuels produced for automotive spark-ignition engines rate in the 80 to 90 Motor octane number range. These bikes don't have what you would call high compression. Octane is only a resistance to detonation and was used in performance engines because of the higher compression ratio therefore the fuel being under higher pressure needed to resist detonation until the spark made it fire. 8 to 1 compression, iron head with a solid cam 262/273 @. 0:1 compression, a minimum octane level of 87 is required. Comparative Study on Gasoline HCCI and DICI Combustion in High Load Range with High Compression Ratio for Passenger Cars Application. And even now with direct injection you can still run 87 in cars as high as 14:1 like the skyactiv engines in the new Mazdas. 49 a gallon. I was surprised to see the manual say 87 octane with a compression ratio of 10. Using anything greater than the recommended octane rating is a waste since the fuel only needs to be stable up to the maximum compression point. Compression – Octane. generally, what octane does a 13-13. the down side is you need to always use freshand good quality pump fuel. But for some engines with high compression ratios like the R1200 in question here, using the specified higher octane DOES improve mileage, because that is the fuel the engine is designed to burn. The higher the compression ratio, the higher the amount of power the engine will produce. 25:1 78cc chamber. I know alot of people run 10 to 1 and have good luck, but Is it really worth the roughly 5 to 7% HP for 1 full point of compression. يعـنى ايه العربيه بتـثقـف ?! :D فى الفديو ده هنفهم يعنى يه Compression ratio و علاقتها بالــ Octane No و سعتها هـتفم ليه. 8:1 compression engine will run OK on low octane fuel. Redshift has always shown a little more drop-off in performance when we've tested it with multiple GPUs, compared to Octane, but it still benefits greatly from having more than one video card to utilize. I run 10 degrees initial timing with 30 degrees total, all in by 2500 RPM. 70 gears so RPM should be about 2800-3000 on the highway. 0:1, and all US Market Vespas are Octane rated using the (R+M)/2 method or PON, AKI, rRON designations. The fuel doesn't pre-ignite simply because it isn't present in the cylinder yet and tends to cool off the compressed air in the cylinder when it does get there near top dead center. 7 psi and the compression ratio is 11:1, the equation to solve for the psi is (14. Don't be a cheap skate. Ok whats the max compression I can run on 93 octane pump gas with an aluminum head. The motor is 13. Typically I am using 93 octane since that is what is around here. The more a gas mixture is compressed the hotter it will get. Which octane you need is mostly a function of compression and ignition timing. John said that anything over 14. 1:1 was high when most cars were below 10:1 at that point. 2 to 1 actual measured compression in my 392 (stock cast iron heads). Refuel on a level surface. 5-1 rated piston were actually only 13-1 in the real world, because my old heads had a huge chamber from all the porting. 80's at around 115 mph. Eighty-seven-octane gasoline is gasoline that contains 87-percent octane and 13-percent heptane (or some other combination of fuels that has the same performance of the 87/13 combination of octane/heptane). However, by splitting large molecules into smaller ones (cracking), modern engines are both more efficient and better performing than their older bretheren. 2 The octane number scale covers the range from 0 to 120 octane number, but this test method has a working range from 40 to 120 octane number. An optimum flex fuel point is right about there to be efficient with both gas and E85. Generally, engines with compression ratios of 9. In other words, for a given octane, if you try to maximize the power of two identical engines, on a given octane, up to the detonation point of that octane, the low compression high boost engine will make more power than the high compression low boost engine. I bought a complete running Chev 355 that was built for drag racing and raced for 1 year. Maximum static compression ratio is a complex choice that depends on many factors beyond just the octane rating of the fuel that the motor will use. When I lived in TX I could easily buy 93 octane, and that's what I used in the same engines down there for 14 years. Quite simply, octane ratings are a measurement of a gas's ability to resist detonation. You should not run your bike on lower than 95 octane even when stock. 7:1-ish is pretty much never seen in road car applications. Also the tighter the quench (the distance between piston and head at TDC) THE. Lucas Octane Booster - A Real Octane Booster! Tested and proven to deliver three times more boost than most other brands. Iron heads, 12:1 compresion, and a short duration cam will make crazy cylinder pressure. I was reading how locating pins may loosen from poor fuel, detonation, etc. So with a deck height of 9. The Suzuki GSX1250FA runs 10. Aluminum and Hemi heads let you get away with a bit more and also the available fuel (which can range from 91 to 93 octane depending on where you are at). Final compression ratios above 12. Vp mr12 or mrx02 any thing else. Hyundai was very conservative picking a 9. To go to a higher compression ratio with no problem. You can try running 87 Octane Fuel and probably won't notice a difference. A higher octane fuel is needed because counter intuitively a higher octane fuel requires a higher compression to ignite compared to a lower octane. Still curious on the low end power gains, is going from 13. 56mm bore 40. 5:1 compression piston. Higher the compression leads to more force generated when the air/fuel mix is ignited. 012 A felpro gasket with compressed height of 0. Here is what I was going to say to you. I was reading about Indy cars yesterday and some of them have 16 to 1 compression and use 124 octane fuel to achieve 700 horsepower. I run 91 octane gas and have never experienced any detonation with this engine. also had a vintage Paxton blowing thru several GT350's with those same engines. But if a car is designed for regular, it's fine on regular. I believe my wife's '07 Honda Civic has a 10. The higher the final compression ratio, the higher the octane rating of the fuel must be in order to help prevent detonation and serious engine damage. Diesel engines usually start at around 20:1 and up (have seen 22:1). As it is now, 93 octane gas and a dozen cans of octane booster won't jack up the octane to satisfy 12. John said that anything over 14. Thant being said I was using the Wallace Dynamic compression calculator. 50 tires, a T19 with a 6. I ran that motor on the street with 91 octane for years. direct injection has basically made the old notion that Higher compression engine require higher octane fuel all but moot. under 12:1 a bike will go bar to bar or to work just fine on 85 - 87 O fuel. Octane looks great but when you set up an animation to render overnight and it crashes you soon learn. Silhouette: 24 inches from top of shoulder to bottom of leg with a 7-1/2 inch side seam (taken from a size Small) Fabric Content: 60% polyurethane, 32% nylon, 8% spandex; Care Instructions: Machine wash cold with like colors. 5:1 compression piston in it. Running richer with better fuel distribution effectively adds 2-3 octane numbers and provides even more on-track protection against detonation than its standard ASTM motor octane rating would indicate. I would like to use them if possible but if I need 100 octane I need to either buy 100 octane or use additives to raise the octane. The higher compression ratio needs the high octane so the engine won't "knock" igninate the fuel before the spark plug fires. 5:1 and 11:1. I burn 87 octane in my 09 Touring bike and it does not ever ping, spit. Most engines will lose ET & MPH if you run too much octane, at least all of mine & friends I've helped out did. A engine that is pre-igniting can produce displaced energy. It is recommend with modern 4-strokes with 12:5 to 13. Sunoco® Standard™ is a 110 octane leaded race fuel that is used in many forms of motorsports. Engines with higher compression ratios usually require higher octane fuels. My dad had a bay boat a few years ago and it would top out 500 RPM better with 93 vs 87 octane. Essentially, the octane rating of gas is the ratio of octane to heptane. John said that anything over 14. Final compression ratios above 12. With compression over 13. 7:1 is the most that is safe with cast iron heads, 9. Its not impossible to run high compression with pump gas. In the US we run the RON and a second test called the MON that tests the fuel compression in a warmed motor with pre-heated fuel at 900 rpm and variable ignition timing to simulate. 5:1 which required purple avgas (115+ octane racing fuel). The Octane number you see on the pump is a measurement on an artificial scale where the Octane of pure heptane is 0, and is 100 for pure octane. 8:1 or both. Blueprinting the cylinder head holds some value, but no where near as much as the compression and deck increases. I also run 13:1 in my small block but run 110 or 112 in it only. This is for engines with compression ratios below 15:1. Rufskin LASC Under Armour 2EROS Cell Block 13 Vaux Jack Adams Diesel Model is 6 ft 1. 3 to 1 Then, if you go to Yamaha YZF-R1 13. MidCitiesMildMan , Oct 16, 2019. 5 to 1 GSX R750 12. Could be that your timing is too far advanced, but if you want some reading to reassure you that running on is a common problem, try this link: (Post No 13 is helpful. 4) The type & octane of fuel you use is a main contributor to what compression to use, so the higher the octane the higher the compression you can use safely but it's still beneficial to run a lower rather than higher compression ratio. then again, if you just take a stock 10:1 long block and give it cams and valve springs and collets and manifolds, you could see 200hp or close to it by 7500. Hey guys so my motor I bought last year popped a head gasket and the cam gear moved causing some valves to fail. what should the compression be of my savage octane v1? I performed the compression test cold and achieved 75 psi dry and with a few drops of oil it achieved 85 psi, should it not be at least 110 psi to 150 psi?. 56mm bore 40. It appears that, at 7. يعـنى ايه العربيه بتـثقـف ?! :D فى الفديو ده هنفهم يعنى يه Compression ratio و علاقتها بالــ Octane No و سعتها هـتفم ليه. cleavitte bearings all around and the whoel 9. Harley faces their air fuel ratio largely on the fact that they run a 14. Maximal’s fast burn rate makes it particularly beneficial in large-bore, large-displacement naturally-aspirated drag racing applications. 5 to 1 compression. Today I went out riding with a friend and he insisted all high-revving motorcycles needed 93 octane (or the highest octane available) to ensure extra power when needed. Then,as usual,the results and opinions on these subjects may vary widely. Octane rating controls at when the fuel will ignite in the cylinder. 6:1 if it were all good. No lifting. Propane has an equivalent octane rating of around 100, good for up to 12:1 compression ratio. All depends. However, by splitting large molecules into smaller ones (cracking), modern engines are both more efficient and better performing than their older bretheren. Tried 110 on the dyno in a 9:1 chevy and then went to 91 with a little polypropylene dioxide and picked up like 10 horse across the sheet. 8:1 compression engine will run OK on low octane fuel. Biron As said, it depends on a LOT of factors, but in general FOR PRE-86 SMALL BLOCKS AND HEADS (cast iron only), 87 Octane is good up to about 9. 510 lift and 230 degrees @. The tight LSA narrows up the power curve and spikes dynamic compression too high too early in the rpm range, to they act more like 11 or 12 to 1 compression than 10 to 1 compression, requiring high octane fuel or timing retarded till they quit pinging. It is very nitrous compatible also. It's probably the warmer weather. If it is a performance engine with cast iron heads and running premium fuel (91 – 93 octane), you don’t really want to get above 10:1. For routine fill ups, my objective is longevity of the engine: I put ethanol-free 91 octane gas from the price club because the price has been consistently 20% more than the lower octane and is ethanol free. I am talking about modern motorcycle engines. 5 to 1, and 93 can go up to about 11. That’s a big difference and a big reduction in knock resistance. 5:1, so clearly, it needs a higher Octane Fuel. RON is determined by running the fuel in a test engine with a variable compression ratio under controlled conditions, and comparing the results with those for mixtures of iso-octane and n-heptane. I plan to buy a good set of aluminum heads. If it is 9. Your static compression is 12:1 but what is your dynamic compression? Your cam plays a big part in the equation. The Octane Coffee and Tea House takes its name from a 1920s gasoline station. Octane does not have more energy than regular gas (not including ethanol). Eighty-seven-octane gasoline is gasoline that contains 87-percent octane and 13-percent heptane (or some other combination of fuels that has the same performance of the 87/13 combination of octane/heptane). Oval port open chamber head with 140 thou. One of the pieces he had are. The motor is 13. 5-1 Compression Ratio. High EGR and high injection pressure with low boost pressure would be the optimum for emissions, fuel efficiency and COV of IMEP 27. 5:1 compression piston. Essentially, the octane rating of gas is the ratio of octane to heptane. Australia mostly uses 91 or 95 octane. Now if you properly built and forged the motor it could handle it but you would have to run race fuel. Compress it just a little and it ignites spontaneously. 8 to 1 compression, iron head with a solid cam 262/273 @. 5:1 compression ratio from the factory. With today's engines that has gone out the window as now engines are running some pretty high compression ratios on 87 octane fuel with Mazda I believe running as high as 13 to 1 compression ratio in their skyactive engines. The longer the jug sits, the lower the octane level becomes, and at some point the fuel is simply too low of octane to be safe for use. I found out it has 13:1 compression pistons in it. should net around 13. In some cases low octane fuel can really zap the power and mileage and this I think is more manufacturer driven than anything. A previous version of this motor (11:1 with similar duration cam but 102 ICL) produced 215 - 230 PSI cold. 6:1 compression) didnt detonate on R Tech ProV1 (96. It's easy to find what octane rating a gas has. for many years now, I build all my bbc with compression ratio's between 10 and 10. 93 octane)? With the pistons I have on my 347 I can get 10. You can run a little more compression, such as 9:1 or 9. 012 A felpro gasket with compressed height of 0. 030 13:1 compression pistons (that’s what he was told they are) he pulled out of a 340 motor that he swapped all back to original. But the jump down to 88 is a big one. 5 to 1 - if the motor is properly dialed in. also had a vintage Paxton blowing thru several GT350's with those same engines. A higher octane rating means that the fuel will tolerate greater compression (more pressure) before it ignites. Octane handles compression very well -- you can compress it a lot and nothing happens. Understanding Octane Grades. A higher octane fuel is needed because counter intuitively a higher octane fuel requires a higher compression to ignite compared to a lower octane. 5mm stroke, redline 14,000 rpm. To release all the potential power of 91 octane gasoline, it is necessary for an engine to have a compression ratio higher than 9. Gasoline is rated by octane. for many years now, I build all my bbc with compression ratio's between 10 and 10. Can I run this on 93 octane? should I mix with 116 race gas? or should I just buy some 104 octane booster and drop that in everytime I fill up? thanks. The stock compression ratio with the original 69cc heads was 8. I really see little diff between 87 and 92 rating,except perhaps in hot weather and then the higher rated gasoline seems a tad better. the only case where higher octane fuel is required is compressions higher than 14:1, as well as turbo applications. I've heard of Mopars blowing out too easy with thin head gaskets but I haven't personally used them. Thirsty 13: Biggest Gas Guzzlers; Goof of the Month: You Put Gas in My Diesel! Illustrated Guide to Gas Stations; In Canada, octane ratings are calculated using an average, sometimes known in shorthand as the Anti-Knock Index, or AKI. Compression definition, the act of compressing. 6:1 compression, made 502hp//567tq I'd go 10:1 and run 91 octane personally. 5 compression, maybe more, 282 degrees duration, 34mm VM mikuni, dual 12mm plugs, 30 BTDC. I am not sure about the bigger displacements for compression ratio and octane level. 5 to 1 - if the motor is properly dialed in. Higher octane does not mean more power except in some very specific conditions, such as computer controlled ignition advance with a knock sensor. To release all the potential power of 91 octane gasoline, it is necessary for an engine to have a compression ratio higher than 9. 5: compression to use 95-96 octane fuel. If it didn't detonate with 215 - 230, I was pretty confident it wouldn't with 195 - 205. 5:1 compression, Victor Jr. Our target compression ratio is thus 9. He said they use to blow cars even at 13:1. 8:1 or both. 5 to 15:1 if tuned properly. The motor is 13. When fitted with L. With today's engines that has gone out the window as now engines are running some pretty high compression ratios on 87 octane fuel with Mazda I believe running as high as 13 to 1 compression ratio in their skyactive engines. The cam is a Racer Brown hydraulic with. Race fuel, on the other hand, at 110 to 118 octane will allow compression ratios of 14. for many years now, I build all my bbc with compression ratio's between 10 and 10. The following is the safe norm for most standard set ups that are properly tuned in the mid to low 11 to 1 air fuel ratio range with standard 8. I've heard of Mopars blowing out too easy with thin head gaskets but I haven't personally used them. Title: 1502. If a high octane fuel (such as 93 octane) is used in a low compression engine (such as an older flathead garden tractor engine) the air/fuel mixture will not burn fast enough. 30, the block was then decked to gain the compression back. These engines run well on pump fuel above 92 Octane, and this is actually recommended by the manufacturers. So what gives. It should be noted that this is not the octane rating seen on the pump in America. She wants to benefit African coffee growers, and she wants a meeting point for people in her community. In a nutshell, high-compression engines designed for performance need high-octane petrol. In a high compression research engine, high- octane 13. 5 to 1 compression or if the engine is equipped with a turbocharger or supercharger. 5:1 small block engine would be very responsive when running on E85 and that extra compression will return some of the lost mileage from E85’s reduced BTU heat output compared to gasoline. They will perform better with 38 degrees advance and 93 octane for sure. engines (compression ratio 8. 5:1 compression piston. Vp mr12 or mrx02 any thing else. The CR on a engine can be 10-1 on one and run 87 octane just fine but that don't mean that all with 10-1 CR can because the camshaft determines the DCR. sure, go higher in compression, if you will have cams, and light pistons, you could make it work with 11:1. And that's a mid-eighties design. There's only three things that affect compression: #1 Boost. I would think that it should be the same. I had a Chrysler 3. If it didn't detonate with 215 - 230, I was pretty confident it wouldn't with 195 - 205. About Fuel and Compression. Octane has nothing to do with power. Use either leaded or unleaded. 4:1 -dynamic compression. SRP set up an 8-pack of 4032 forged pistons that feature a 1. Harley faces their air fuel ratio largely on the fact that they run a 14. That is why so many high output motors run high octane, the higher compression will cause a lower octane fuel to pre-detonate because (believe it or not) lower octane means the fuel will ignite more easily, burn hotter. This, in turn, increases the risk of piston seizure and damage to the engine. Most competition engines are 13 to 1 and over so they require higher octane fuel. The Octane Coffee and Tea House takes its name from a 1920s gasoline station. Check the compression ratio stamped between 2 and 3 next to the engine number. The critical thing is when you spark. Do not iron. High compression engine, bullsh. You would have to use 91 or 93 is you were over 13. They don't need much timing advance to make full power. The blower I'm going to use will up the CR to 9. 2 The octane number scale covers the range from 0 to 120 octane number, but this test method has a working range from 40 to 120 octane number. like mentioned above, you NEED to use 98-100 octane gas with 12:1 compression. BMW M3's and M5's, Porsche 911's (non turbo), Ferrari's, Lamborghini's, etc. This minimizes the compression and pumping work while maintaining the 13:1 expansion stroke which helps thermal efficiency. Hello All, A question about Octane vs Compression ratio: With the prices of gasoline going sky-high, and the possibility of running lower-octane, what is the relationship between the two? If you are going to rebuild an engine, should the compression ratio be high or low if you run 89 octane? Steve [This message has been edited by SteveFlier (edited 05-09-2001). 5:1 compression and at 34 psi of boost I ran only Shell 93 and the car ran [email protected] mph. There’s a highly-sensitive and accurate knock-sensor and computer hooked up to this engine that gives a readout of knock. List the engine build, but if it is a drag motor C-16 is a very popular fuel for engines in the 14+ 1 1 compression ratios. 5:1 and have no pinging (a sign you need higher octane slower cooler burning fuel!) The need for higher octane fuel is a down side. It was my daily driver. 0:1) Premium fuels of minimum 93-octane Research up to 97-octane are required, with preference to 93/97. I purchased a racing 340 engine that currently has a compression ratio of 13:1 - This was built for race fuel obviously. The 13:1, sure, he could put a big cam in, ground late, but it'd be a pig and need a ton of timing to run, the correct combo with less compression would walk all over it in almost every situation. The motor is 13. I'm running a 350 with 12. Since my Frontier seems to be drinking gas at a more alarming rate than I first thought, I will try 89 octane on this next fill-up and see what happens. Biron As said, it depends on a LOT of factors, but in general FOR PRE-86 SMALL BLOCKS AND HEADS (cast iron only), 87 Octane is good up to about 9. 5 is 10:1 ratio, 87 should be good. the highest compression that you want to go with on pump gas is 11:1 or maybe 12:1 if you are careful and only run the high octane, but you will run into detonation issues if the engine gets really warm. It's at a Gas City at Valencia & Houghton. 5mm stroke, redline 14,000 rpm. you can run CR 250R head and base gaskets to bump up the compression a little bit and still get away with 94 octane. I was curious about the octane I should be running in my car. What is a general safe effective compression ratio on E85? The internet results in varying opinions from 13:1 up to an extreme 20:1. So what gives. Might have to email them on that. What's the most compression you can run and still run pump gas? There's a gas station local to me that sells 91 octane without any Ethanol. Use either leaded or unleaded. I have actually ran it on 87 octane and it was fine, but it was only to move it around while the truck was being worked on. They charge $7. No way will this engine run on pump gas. Using lower than specified octane can produce knock, causing the ECU to change spark timing, reducing power and efficiency. Do not bleach. The motor is 13. What compression ratio is Sunoco Maximal 116 designed for? Compression ratios up to 17:1 6. Always consult the manufacturer's octane recommendation to determine the proper octane requirements for any given vehicle. I am going to go look at a built up yfz and it has a CP 13. 8:1 or both. org ok so im looking at running a 13. No mention of the fact that they aren't comparing things equally (I doubt they even know the difference by the rest of the article). So, they're concerned about the octane being too low, not too high. It was a 455, that has been destroked and bored over. 7∶1, and it is common to find motorcycles with compression ratios above 12. But if a car is designed for regular, it's fine on regular. The tight LSA narrows up the power curve and spikes dynamic compression too high too early in the rpm range, to they act more like 11 or 12 to 1 compression than 10 to 1 compression, requiring high octane fuel or timing retarded till they quit pinging. + By advancing the valve timing allows some blow back into the intake manifold that reduces some compression. • Color: Red • Motor. It's probably the warmer weather. 4 to 1 are not recommended for use with "premium pump gasoline. 760 at 60° F. I also run 13:1 in my small block but run 110 or 112 in it only. 5:1 compression, Victor Jr. This single-cylinder wonder has a four bowl carburetor and a movable cylinder head that can vary the compression ratio between 4:1 to 18:1 while the engine is running. I've never had any issues. Engine building book I have says 5 point of octane per each point of compression increase. 5:1 and running a lower octane gas (87. Rufskin LASC Under Armour 2EROS Cell Block 13 Vaux Jack Adams Diesel Model is 6 ft 1. minimum octane rating of 89 (R+M/2). 760 at 60° F. i understand i will need higher octane. Which brings us to the octane ratings in gasoline. I'd like to know exactly but the motor has been modified alot. 7 = 147 PSI. 1:1 was high when most cars were below 10:1 at that point. 5) or Outlaw (98). يعـنى ايه العربيه بتـثقـف ?! :D فى الفديو ده هنفهم يعنى يه Compression ratio و علاقتها بالــ Octane No و سعتها هـتفم ليه. Vp mr12 or mrx02 any thing else. all a compression tester is telling you is cranking psi. Here is what I was going to say to you. The compression ratio depends on the size of the dome on the pistons (in cc's) and the combustion chamber size of the heads (cc's) among a few other things. Currently have XC800 and was planning to take it, but can't get any ECU mapping to allow for low octane fuel. A typical early 70's musclecar ran on 92 octane leaded gas and commonly ran 9. Tumble dry low. You could run 12:1 and use 87 octane, but you would have to pull timing to not detonate. May go 11:1. 2 to one may knock at higher tempuratures with 87 octane and be fine at lower tempuratures with 85 octane. The 1/16, 1/16, 3/16th-inch ring pack features one of SRP’s Classic High Performance moly top rings to go with a cast second ring and standard oil ring set. VP, Cam 2 or Sunoco leaded race gas race will do the trick @ $8. What compression ratio is Sunoco Maximal 116 designed for? Compression ratios up to 17:1 6. It was not pressure charged but 13. (RON+MON) method = 87 octane most common form of rating in the west. If you are already running 13:1. • Color: Red • Motor. Thant being said I was using the Wallace Dynamic compression calculator. Regards Philip A. 7 to 1 and they all run on 87 octane with iron heads. I am going to go look at a built up yfz and it has a CP 13. Understand, my old Cherokee 140 was designed to run on 80 octane but all I could buy was 100LL. If you have a high compression motor (over 9. 5:1 or higher But they wanted that 87 octane use. 5 to 1, and 93 can go up to about 11. (So you can run total octane formulas) 32:1 is my choice I don’t have numbers saying 40/32/24 is better, but I prefer as much fuel as possible. With almost 13:1 compression and 45 degrees of advance, I won't run anything less than 110 race gas. Hyundai was very conservative picking a 9. If it pings, go up to the next grade and see if it stops, the VTX's are designed for 87 octane. i hate it when people talk about a 2-stroke having 160psi on a compression gage and then using that to determine the need for race gas. My own vehicle has a compression ratio of 10. There’s a highly-sensitive and accurate knock-sensor and computer hooked up to this engine that gives a readout of knock. So, they're concerned about the octane being too low, not too high. my 414 ci 396 had 11. Look at normal octane, its physical properties are nearly the same as isooctane, yet it has a 0 octane value and if used as a fuel, the compression ratio for an engine would have to be about 4:1 The original OP was for E85, unless you know what the other 15% is, you can't committ to a compression ratio. I don't know how the D-series head compares with B-series, but Jeff at IB had some B-series motors running 12. 9:1 static & 8. I looked into the compression ratio after accidentally pumped 87 octane gas and didn’t notice any performance difference from the retard timing due to knock sensor when accerating hard. PDF Author: mbaker Created Date: 9/9/2003 3:30:16 PM. I was going to go with an AFR 185 61cc head but can I go with the 58cc head and still run pump. 5:1 compression!! The guy I bought it from recommended I use 25% Race Fuel, the rest 91octane. 8-1 355 last year on 94 octane pumpgas. | Honda TRX 450R. generally, what octane does a 13-13. Rufskin LASC Under Armour 2EROS Cell Block 13 Vaux Jack Adams Diesel Model is 6 ft 1. Jeff Smith: This is an interesting question that came out of last month's discussion about E85. Likewise, if the dynamic compression were 8:1 @ one atmosphere, under the improved VE it would rise to 9. Maximal’s fast burn rate makes it particularly beneficial in large-bore, large-displacement naturally-aspirated drag racing applications. 5:1 compression ratio, and regular fuel is all that's required. The AKI is calculated by simply combining the Research Octane Number (RON) and the Motor Octane Number (MON). Just for giggles I modeled a 406 in Engine Analyzer using E-techs, a hydraulic roller cam similar to the duration you list, gave it plenty of carb, exhaust, pump 93 octane and 9. What is a general safe effective compression ratio on E85? The internet results in varying opinions from 13:1 up to an extreme 20:1. People often think of high octane fuel as being more flammable, and easier to explode, whereas that is actually the opposite of the truth. Cell Block 13 style CBS071-GRY; Item No. But, there are so many exceptions to that rule. ask me how I found out at Bonneville lake. Contrary to what many people think and what the oil companies would like us to believe, higher grades of gasoline do not contain more energy for your car to run. I say bite the bullet and spend the money for good fuel. 5:1 which required purple avgas (115+ octane racing fuel). Now, when I look up compression ratios and their appropriate octane I should theoretically be using over 100 octane fuel. And even now with direct injection you can still run 87 in cars as high as 14:1 like the skyactiv engines in the new Mazdas. On the economics of high octane fuels, one study found that the refinery cost of increasing octane to 98 RON from 93 RON is only $0. With a smaller cam I'd have to change heads to drop compression. Depending on the exact gas, you may need pure, or mostly. Well said, I would add : If the car has higher compression ratio then use higher octane fuel. Our local 3/8 clay track has 360ci sprints running in the 12's. my 414 ci 396 had 11. Products and services for all your petroleum needs. For example if your air fuel mixture at sea level was 14. I am going to go look at a built up yfz and it has a CP 13. For example, 87 octane gas has 87% octane and 13% heptane. 65 per gallon. I run 91 octane gas and have never experienced any detonation with this engine. But for some engines with high compression ratios like the R1200 in question here, using the specified higher octane DOES improve mileage, because that is the fuel the engine is designed to burn. This engine will think it is running with 6. Don't be a cheap skate. (This is known as engine knock and can be. Simple, higher octane rating= higher energy rating= higher gas burning rate. An optimum flex fuel point is right about there to be efficient with both gas and E85. Super fuels in the 100-octane range can be used if preferred. But, that 11:1 is an assumption, unless the seller can show you actual measurements (in cc's). It was astoundingly low: 1935-1950 engines ran said 6-ish CR and Octane was 70-80. " The higher the final compression ratio the higher the octane rating of the gasoline must be in order to help prevent detonation and serious engine damage. Maximal’s fast burn rate makes it particularly beneficial in large-bore, large-displacement naturally-aspirated drag racing applications. That's a very HIGH compression ratio for a gas engine. 0) then use normal 91 octane unleaded. if you get up to the 12. Iron heads, 12:1 compresion, and a short duration cam will make crazy cylinder pressure. direct injection has basically made the old notion that Higher compression engine require higher octane fuel all but moot. The high compression of the sport model mini's can cause the fuel to burn at times outside of when there is the spark. Running richer with better fuel distribution effectively adds 2-3 octane numbers and provides even more on-track protection against detonation than its standard ASTM motor octane rating would indicate. But at 8-10 advance and low rpm will run just fine. 8-1 355 last year on 94 octane pumpgas. Lower compression engines need less octane because they want the fuel. 039 So a calculated quench of 0. more so than just the compression value. for example, you can have a stock OEM port banshee w. 5:1 427 BBC 100 octane and 35 degrees all in advanced 1600-5600 RPM. 5:1 piston require? roughly im looking at using the kemco additive inplace of race gas. also if you used TRX 250R gaskets you lowered your compression. Depending on the exact gas, you may need pure, or mostly. Back in the '60's and early '70's before all the emissions requirements, muscle cars had high compression ratio engines, 10. You can run a little more compression, such as 9:1 or 9. Just for giggles I modeled a 406 in Engine Analyzer using E-techs, a hydraulic roller cam similar to the duration you list, gave it plenty of carb, exhaust, pump 93 octane and 9. Higher ratios cause higher cylinder pressures and therefore cause the engine to be more susceptible to pre-detonation or knock. Jeff Smith: This is an interesting question that came out of last month's discussion about E85. It can indirectly give an ABILITY to achieve more gas mileage with more aggresive timing/fuel maps but the octane in and of itself does not affect gas mileage. 110 octane race gas is much tougher to light than low grade 87 octane. Eighty-seven-octane gasoline is gasoline that contains 87-percent octane and 13-percent heptane (or some other combination of fuels that has the same performance of the 87/13 combination of octane/heptane). The higher the final compression ratio, the higher the octane rating of the fuel must be in order to help prevent detonation and serious engine damage. But if a car is designed for regular, it's fine on regular. if you stay under 12:1 then you should be able to stick with 91 pump gas. Manufacturers compression ratio will be tested and the octane necessary will be in an owners manual. They also have C12, which they advertise as one of the winningest fuels in racing history. The owner runs C12 in it now. Power is determined by a number of factors and the compression ratio is one of the prime factors. Race fuel, on the other hand, at 110 to 118 octane will allow compression ratios of 14. 5:1 and higher then you're going to need the higher octane. Since the octane test engine used here is water cooled, you must increase the octane requirements slightly to compensate for your hotter air-cooled engine. At 9:1 static ratio, you can run 87 octane all day as long as you don't push any boost at it. Ran it for several hundred miles, using mid grade or premium fuel and Doo semi synthetic oil. 13:1 ( or near that,I think they changed slightly in the 4. Factory gaseous Onan engines have high-compression pistons/heads, but getting anywhere near 12:1 in an Onan is, well good luck, especially if it's a flathead. Recommended octane levels for new Toyota vehicles. Not to mention you would have to run around 110 octane or better. John said that anything over 14. Friend is considering building a N/A high compression 396 for his Chevelle SS. Motor: Liquid-cooled 60° V-Twin; Valve train: DOHC, 4 valves per cylinder; Bore x stroke: 101. I've heard of Mopars blowing out too easy with thin head gaskets but I haven't personally used them. i hate it when people talk about a 2-stroke having 160psi on a compression gage and then using that to determine the need for race gas. As a general rule, the best available pump gas will work with an 8. 5 is 10:1 ratio, 87 should be good. 57% improvement in economy. The problem is that the motor was previously running Alcohol so the compression ratio is somewhere between 12:1 and 14. Higher octane is only useful in high compression ratio engines. Because higher octane gas burns slower, it is more resistant to knock when subjected to higher RPM and cylinder pressures. One that smashes the mixture down to 1/12th it's volume would likely need a higher octane fuel to avoid pre-ignition. 65 per gallon. And that's a mid-eighties design. One of the pieces he had are. (RON) method = 91 octane Running higher octane levels above recommendations increases carbon build up which can cause you severe problems. All depends. The average retail price difference between regular and premium grade gasoline has doubled – $0. I did the math numerous times and if the difference in price for the 91 and the 89 E10 was $. The most common type of octane rating worldwide is the Research Octane Number (RON). The first two fill-ups were with 87 octane regular as I recalled the manual calling for such. This is accomplished by better combustion space design, as well as superior air-fuel ratio control through electronic fuel injection (EFI). يعـنى ايه العربيه بتـثقـف ?! :D فى الفديو ده هنفهم يعنى يه Compression ratio و علاقتها بالــ Octane No و سعتها هـتفم ليه. 5-1 rated piston were actually only 13-1 in the real world, because my old heads had a huge chamber from all the porting. List the engine build, but if it is a drag motor C-16 is a very popular fuel for engines in the 14+ 1 1 compression ratios. That translates to reduced absolute compression in the cylinder. These are variable-compression single-cylinder engines that can vary their compression between about 7. But at 8-10 advance and low rpm will run just fine. Motor is a 2. Now my race car is another story. 039 So a calculated quench of 0. I was told that I could run 91 octane pump gas with that high of compression ratio with some type of blow off valve or cam shaft. But if a car is designed for regular, it's fine on regular. Higher octane does not mean more power except in some very specific conditions, such as computer controlled ignition advance with a knock sensor. Sunoco Maximal is a 116 octane extreme performance leaded racing fuel designed for high revving racing engines with high compression ratios. TRW , L2443 N--Standard bore. Older gasoline engines did have high compression ratios like 13:1, but we were also 30 years ago able to buy gasoline with 102 octane readily. 5:1 high compression piston and really like how it works I use 92 octane pump gas. I'd say 11:1 with iron heads is too much for pump gas. Compression definition, the act of compressing. It spontaneously ignites at a given compression level, and can only be used in engines that do not exceed that compression ratio. What Octane do i have to run with a 427 motor. Refer back to our formulas, and note that it is possible to gain 40-50 psi by increasing the compression ratio by 1. With this formula, you can develop a better guide for a specific engine. Both octane and heptane burn the same except octane is very stable when compressed where heptane isn't. The high compression of the sport model mini's can cause the fuel to burn at times outside of when there is the spark. 13:1 compression. There’s a highly-sensitive and accurate knock-sensor and computer hooked up to this engine that gives a readout of knock. 02-23-13 01:06 PM - Post# 2319895 In response to Jim. 5 to 1 RM-Z450 12. It's impossible to guess how much power losing a point of compression will lose because we don't know the rest of the combination. Also available for Motorcycles in 2 ounce bottle. Essentially, the octane rating of gas is the ratio of octane to heptane. Higher octane fuel is recommended. @anon481: All of the engines you listed are all small displacement engines, so even a 13:1 engine with a displacement of 120 cu inches is not even close to the total compression of a 455 cu in with a ratio of 9:1. (So you can run total octane formulas) 32:1 is my choice I don’t have numbers saying 40/32/24 is better, but I prefer as much fuel as possible. Now my race car is another story. Albeit they use some exotic, custom, one-off parts and years of experience. If you note an improvement in fuel economy that justifies using higher octane fuel at the higher price, then go for it. 7 psi and the compression ratio is 11:1, the equation to solve for the psi is (14. This is accomplished by better combustion space design, as well as superior air-fuel ratio control through electronic fuel injection (EFI). 5:1, then 89 octane may be required, depending on ignition timing. It's not too far from my work and not far from the SIR drag track out here. Higher octane does not mean more power except in some very specific conditions, such as computer controlled ignition advance with a knock sensor. Generally, regular is 87 octane, mid-grade is 89 octane, and premium is 91 or 93 octane. However a Honda Rebel with a compression ratio of 9. i would personally never run less than 100 octane. Im posting this question for a friend. ask me how I found out at Bonneville lake. If it pings, go up to the next grade and see if it stops, the VTX's are designed for 87 octane. There are several things that determine the octane level required such as combustion chamber shape also contributes. Timing was locked at 28-30ish and was never a problem. To use a fuel that's stable to 14:1 compression in a 11:1 engine is pointless. org ok so im looking at running a 13. Just talked to her about this on the phone. Designed in Los Angeles. Super fuels in the 100-octane range can be used if preferred. When researching on what octane fuel I should be using I am getting mixed answers. Octane does not have more energy than regular gas (not including ethanol). The critical thing is when you spark. Understanding Octane Grades. 65 per gallon. 25:1 78cc chamber. In a high compression research engine, high- octane 13. more so than just the compression value. There's only three things that affect compression: #1 Boost. Timing was locked at 28-30ish and was never a problem. Our Fuel Additives lineup includes premium Dual-Sport Bike products from the biggest names in the game. I run 91 octane gas and have never experienced any detonation with this engine. i would personally never run less than 100 octane. So - in 1947 Pump Gas was NOT the 89/92 R+M/2 of today. I am not sure about the bigger displacements for compression ratio and octane level. You have to check the specific gravity and octane rating yourself to be sure, I wouldn't trust a pump. Some websites say 93, some say 105+ The car is tuned and is running on 93. Octane rating is just resistant to pre-mature detonation. the time from when the. (BMEP goes up octane need to go up) 8:1 bike will pre ignite on 105 O fuel at 100 deg F at full throttle,little above sea level. 2 Stroke Performance. 4:1 (it's Australia: my ride, a 3. The 100 is the Motor octane rating, and so therefore AvGas 100LL is 100 Motor octane. Zero deck block and flat top pistons. 760 at 60° F. Lower compression engines need less octane because they want the fuel. Discussion Starter • #1 • Jul 13, 2009. 7 to 1 compression ratio. When I rebuilt my Charger 273 the Egge HP pistons were a little over 9:1. In the USA, the fuel grades range between 87-91octane. It spontaneously ignites at a given compression level, and can only be used in engines that do not exceed that compression ratio. It's called "octane" because there was a baseline measurement done for combustion rate on octane (8-carbon hydrogen-saturated molecule, like propane is a 3 carbon saturated molecule I think, it's been a long time since Orgo). I ran that motor on the street with 91 octane for years. Factory gaseous Onan engines have high-compression pistons/heads, but getting anywhere near 12:1 in an Onan is, well good luck, especially if it's a flathead.